Aliens Don't Exist and If They Did, It's Irrelevant

[Parture]

You misread the Bible. Gen. 1.1 God created perfectly. It doesn't say how long it took. The universe is only 13.7 billion years old, not trillions. And it was 6000 years ago when God created the first God-conscious man when He breathed in the breath of life directly creating man's spirit which when made contact with the body man became a living soul. We know aliens don't exist because no life can exist on another planet. There are over 800 variables required for life to exist on another planet. There is not enough planets in the universe to make that possible.

[wootwoot]

You misread the Bible. Gen. 1.1 God created perfectly. It doesn't say how long it took. The universe is only 13.7 billion years old, not trillions. And it was 6000 years ago when God created the first God-conscious man when He breathed in the breath of life directly creating man's spirit which when made contact with the body man became a living soul. We know aliens don't exist because no life can exist on another planet. There are over 800 variables required for life to exist on another planet. There is not enough planets in the universe to make that possible.

What? That's insane! There's not enough planets! HELLO! Has anyone seen the Hubble Deep Field Photograph. In ONE LITTLE SPEC of the night sky that's not even VISIBLE TO US, there's over 10000 galaxies which each hold between 200-400 million stars, each holding around 2-40 planets each solar system, AND THAT'S JUST ONE SPEC OF SKY which means there's probably over 300 trillian galaxies, multiply that by 300 million stars each, multiply that by 5 to UNDERESTIMATE THE AMOUNT OF PLANETS and you have about.....1000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00000000 planets...and times that number by 30 billion....like.....not enough planets? Not enough planets? There's WAY too many planets. People should be SCARED by the amount of planets out there because that means the chances of life, even being REALLLLLY rare means that the universe is probably PACKED with life.

Earth is an anthill next to a 10 lane super-highway people! Now for those of you who think I mean there's an actual highway out there, I'm being metaphorical to prove a point to you to give you perspective on your life.

You think god can only share his love with planet earth? You think planet earth is the only one that can love god?

The religious people of this world have to prepare themselves for the very real possibility that they may come in contact with extraterrestrials that are much more intelligent than us and that are much more spiritually evolved than us. This means that when they come out of the sky they may appear as angels to us because of their spiritual growth so far beyond ours, but they will not be angels they will be extraterrestrials coming to share that same love of god with us that we share with them.

Same goes for all religions, god created all the religions. All the religions have truth in them. But not all followers are true! But the core of every religion in this world shares in one thing: The love of God/creator force of this universal existence and the hope to better themselves through avoiding the negative and embracing the positive.

Do not get caught up in simple miscalculations of each others religions and allow that to divide humanity. A muslim mother and child deserve gods love just as much as us, and she has gods love through muhammads teachings of christ, and the quran.

Do not try to find disagreements with Bhuddism, Quran, Hinduism, or Judaism. Because the core religion teaches the same core love that christianity teaches, it's just the followers that can be mislead. Just like there are christian followers that can be mislead.

How can we live in harmony? First we need to know we are all madly in love with the same God. - St. Thomas Aquinas

I love each and every one of you, Jesus loves you, muhammad loves you, bhudda loves you, God loves you. God bless us all.

If we come in contact with extraterrestrials, don't worry, or feel that the meaning of the bible has been lost, the bible will always be important even after extraterrestrials come down to this earth because 7 sins, 7 heavenly virtues, 10 commandments, those are all REALLY GOOD POINTS that EVERYONE should read and feel better knowing them than NOT knowing them.

God's love flourishes on this planet and TRILLIONS OF OTHERS. God's creation is beautiful.

[Churchwork]

wootwoot,

I removed your account because in your profile you said you are an Apostle for the Church which obviously you are not since you believe in salvation by works and you are a universalist. You're going to Hell.

You're not doing your homework. I just said when you divide those 800 variables into the number of known planets, there is not enough planets for life to exist on another planet. Study the work done by Hugh Ross.

God has no purpose for life on more than one planet. One planet is more than enough to find a people who love Him to spend eternity with. More than one planet is vanity! God considers it evil to create a paradigm that could potentially involve wars between humans and aliens which would most certainly occur. We are not guilty for the sins of beings from another planet. We are guilty for our own sins right here on earth. In the same way, multi verses are pointless endeavors also. Watch the tv series The Fringe to see what I mean.

God didn't create any religion except the faith of ancient Israelites and Christianity, for it is the only true religion. All these other religions you favor eternally separate themselves from God because they will for eternity reject the love of God giving His only begotten Son, who Himself is God (2nd Person of the Trinity) to die on the cross for the sins of the world.

Jesus said the world would be divided because of the hostility of people like yourself who misrepresent Him in your contradictory ecumenicalism. A Muslim woman who accepts the teachings of Muhammad is going to Hell, for she has accepted the lie that Jesus never died on the cross. She knows better in her own conscience that Islam is false, just by observing its fruit if nothing else. She could be saved by accepting the God of the mountains and stars then surely if she was presented the Son would accept Him too for the Father and the Son are One Being.

The core teachings in all these faiths are false and diabolically opposite to Christianity. In Christianity God died on the cross for the sins of the world to save whosoever is willing to believe in Him to receive eternal life and not go to Hell.

Buddhism is Atheism and teaches shutting your mind down like a zombie in Nirvana. God doesn't want you to do that. He wants you to solve problems and embrace your senses. And Atheism teaches there is no God. The Quran is false because it teaches Jesus never died on the cross, thus didn't die for the sins of the world. Hinduism is false because the population would be far greater than it is if it were true, and its god is amoral. How can God have morals below our own? And obviously you are not coming back as a chicken if you are a bad human. That never effectively deals with sin. And of course Judaism is false because to reject the Messiah is deserving of eternal damnation.

All of these religions are works based faiths too in which they claim a person can lose salvation. Whereas in Christianity a person who is born-again, receiving eternal life, can never lose salvation, for the Bible says we "shall never perish" (John 10.28). It takes quite the arrogant mind to think you can bridge the gap between you and God by your own strength.

The Great Tribulation is coming in which the people of the world will almost destroy themselves, but Jesus says He returns for the sake of the elect then follows the regeneration of the world (Matt. 19.28). The elect would be people like me who are born-again who have God's uncreated life.

Muhammad doesn't love you, he was a murderous tyrant and lies about Jesus. Buddha doesn't love you, he's just a fat pig who hated God. But Jesus does love you, for not only did He create you, He provided a way of salvation for you through His precious blood for forgiveness of sins and reconciliation back to God.

I can't comment on what St. Thomas Aquinas said whether he was talking about just Christians who are already saved or if he was talking about something else.

The Bible says we are not saved by works lest anyone should boast, so your "saving 7 sins, 7 heavenly virtues, 10 commandments" theory will most certainly fail you, as you create a law unto yourself you don't even keep. If you try to live by the law even a law you create unto yourself, you will die by that law and eternally separate yourself from the love of God and God Himself. Your 7-7-10 theory reminds me of Wayne Dyer's Ten Dumbmandments.

[Itinerant Lurker]

You're not doing your homework. I just said when you divide those 800 variables into the number of known planets, there is not enough planets for life to exist on another planet. Study the work done by Hugh Ross.

Actually, we've found almost 800 extra-solar planets in the relatively short time we've been able to look for them, and it's estimated that our galaxy contains at least 160 billion planets which orbit stars. Of those we've discovered, a significant percentage of planets and moons are within the habitable zones of their stars. Is Ross taking into account the updated data astronomers now have concerning extra-solar planets, particularly from the Kepler probe?




Lurker

[Churchwork]

800 variables have been found so far requiring life to exist on another planet. There are not enough planets in the universe to meet that probability.

[Itinerant Lurker]

800 variables have been found so far requiring life to exist on another planet. There are not enough planets in the universe to meet that probability.

Do you know where I could go to read more about these 800 variables? Thanks.




Lurker

[Churchwork]

Do you know where I could go to read more about these 800 variables? Thanks.

Yes, in the books by Hugh Ross such as The Creator and the Cosmos and other books he has written. I got this information from him. People are unaware of how many factors there are that go into requiring life to be able to exist on a planet. They just assume because there are so many planets surely the odds are in their favor. But when you examine that, indeed, there are so many variables involved (even more we haven't thought of) you realize life can't originate on another planet. And it's quite elegant to think of it that way too, because it serves no purpose. God's glory is manifested on this one planet making man in His image to save and choose out a people for Himself to spend eternity with (the rest go with you to Hell). Life on another planet is actually vain, serves no purpose and totally unnecessary.

[Itinerant Lurker]

So I got the chance to try and run down your claims about Hugh Ross’ “800 variables for life”. I don’t have the book, but the only online references I could find were simply more second-hand references to it which, given the tendency for creationists to make up stuff like this, left me a bit dubious.

Fortuitously, I am quite familiar with Ross’ website, “Reasons to Believe”, from my days as an OEC. It turns out that your claim of 800 variables is, at best, very outdated (it was ostensibly “sourced” in a book from 1995, after all). Ross has a few articles on what he sees as the fine tuning of life on earth from 2001 and 2004 which detail not 800 but 154 parameters for life (Fine Tuning for Life on Earth), and which assign probabilities to some of them (Probabilities for Life on Earth).

There are a few very good reasons to think that Ross is grossly exagerrating what would be required for life to arise, not the least of which include that he doesn’t appear to explain his basis for assigning probabilities to his parameters, and that he seems to ignore that many of his parameters are interdependent or just downright unnecessary. (I can provide some examples of this if you'd like - just let me know).

I guess what I’d like to know is what is it about Ross’ apparently flawed claims that you find more compelling than the claims of other scientists? Is it really the strength of his evidence, or is it simply because it confirms your pre-existing beliefs? If the former, what specific evidence do you find particularly compelling (and why didn’t you simply present it when I, on multiple occasions, politely asked?); if the latter, shouldn’t that be the basis for some pretty drastic self-examination of your motives?

As always, I appreciate your taking to the time to reply.




Lurker

[Churchwork]

The number of variables has increased from under 100 to over 800. When you divide through the number of estimated planets in the universe, it's impossible for life to exist on another planet. Ross and others have done their analysis. What they have in common is there is not enough planets in the universe for life to exist on another planet. So does this agree with or disagree with God's glory? I believe God's glory is manifestly greater in creating this entire universe for life to exist on just one planet as it would be redundantly unnecessary otherwise, and His precision work would have to be even more precise for life to exist on just one planet. That's my God the God of the Bible.