Churchwork
08-24-2013, 01:16 AM
Re: http://www.greatbiblestudy.com/once-saved_always-saved.php
Those who need to hold tightly to the once-saved theory, are those who's minds are bound in dead religion. They do not grasp the concept of God's love, grace, and mercy towards us, and therefore need to feel secure, because they do not feel worthy as they are attempting to be saved by works. They feel that one mistake, and God is angry with them.
I am once-saved-always-saved by God's love, grace and mercy. I feel secure because I gave my life to the God who secures. I do feel worthy, for I gave my life to Christ, and He tells me by the Holy Spirit I have made the right choice. Where is the work in that free choice to accept the God who keeps? If I make a mistake, God draws me to repent not as an angry tyrant. Based on these comments, my experience doesn't match your claim Robert. It seems to me Robert, you are making stuff up to rationalize a false teaching of non-OSAS. I can feel your pride.
Why is it so important to preach against once-saved? Because millions of souls are in hell because the church has not done it's job educating the body. While we are out evangelizing the sinners, there are people in our own congregations that are on their way to hell. Why? One good reason is unforgiveness. The Bible is crystal clear that if we don't forgive those who wrong us, then we are not going to receive forgiveness for our own sins, and as a result, we abide in spiritual death.
An unforgiving Christian can't lose eternal life, but he can lose the reward of reigning with Christ during the 1000 years. As I read the Bible nobody has gone to Hell yet. The Antichrist will be the first person that Jesus sends to Hell when He returns to reign on earth for 1000 years.
No murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.
No Christian would have murdered someone. Eternal life can't be lost. It's eternal.
God isn't going to offer you something then turn around and change His mind.
I agree. God is not going to give someone eternal life then take it away. When someone is born-again they can't be unborn.
For I say unto you, That unto every one which hath shall be given; and from him that hath not, even that he hath shall be taken away from him. If a man abide [remain] not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
What is taken away? Any sort of reward though one cannot lose eternal life once received. The Lake of Fire can, indeed, burn off the dross of your false works, but into Hell no Christian shall reside because they have eternal life.
And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. Apparently, the person was in the book of life, in order for God to remove him.
The person isn't removed in this case. A part is taken away, not the entire person, for a person who has eternal life remains saved forever. The tree of life and the holy city are the same here as are spoken of in 22.14. The difference, however, lies in the fact that whereas 22.14 mentions only entering the holy city, 22.18 speaks about having the holy city as one’s portion. None is allowed to add to or to take away from the words of this book. The warning against this is most serious.
I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman [gardener]. Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit. And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Taken away where? To that place of loss of rewards, not loss of life. The servant is still a servant but unprofitable, so he loses the reward in outer darkness which is outside the light of reward of reigning with Christ 1000 years. Weeping indicates sorry for one's self. Gnashing of teeth indicates regret.
The Bible is very clear that a person can be in the Lamb's book of life, and then blotted out, so apparently, even though a person may be in the book of life at one point, it does not mean they will always have that eternal life... yes, it can be taken from them!
Every human being is initially in the book of life. They don't have eternal life until they give their life to Christ. It's a free-choice that has to be played out. One is blotted out by dying without giving one's life to Christ.
Our initial salvation does not require works (we cannot earn our way to heaven), but after we are saved, our faith (if it is genuine) ought to begin to yield fruit of righteousness and goodness in our lives. The Bible goes on to tell us that if our faith does not yield these things, then it is dead: But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? ... Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
If our initial salvation does not require our works or self-strength then neither can we lose it based on these. A faith in Christ but effectively is dead has consequences, but one of those consequences is not loss of life. Man is justified by faith and works: faith for initial salvation, and increased faith and works unto rewards, not loss of life.
What then is the danger of being a non-OSASer? You act like God, self-exalting yourself, creating an arbitrary dividing line that only you agree with works you decide that are good enough. Either you are never sure if you are saved, or if confident that you think you are saved but that Satan always casts doubt that you could lose it. Either way, non-OSAS is a false faith not of God, shared by most other religions of the world, but distinctly not Christian.
Robert L. don't you know right now you are not saved, and you are going to Hell? because you refuse to give your life to the Jesus who keeps and never lets any perish who have died on the cross with Him (John 10.28)? God is infinitely greater than you so no work or act of self-strength can preserve you. If salvation depended on you keeping yourself saved no human being would ever get saved, for all souls eventually would fail.
Self-righteousness and pride of life are at the center of the heart of a non-OSASer. There are lots of you out there starting with the Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox Church and lots of Protestant denominations also, probably over 2 billion. Not a "little flock" (Luke 12.32). Throw yourself into that heaping mess is a sure way to Hell.
Those who need to hold tightly to the once-saved theory, are those who's minds are bound in dead religion. They do not grasp the concept of God's love, grace, and mercy towards us, and therefore need to feel secure, because they do not feel worthy as they are attempting to be saved by works. They feel that one mistake, and God is angry with them.
I am once-saved-always-saved by God's love, grace and mercy. I feel secure because I gave my life to the God who secures. I do feel worthy, for I gave my life to Christ, and He tells me by the Holy Spirit I have made the right choice. Where is the work in that free choice to accept the God who keeps? If I make a mistake, God draws me to repent not as an angry tyrant. Based on these comments, my experience doesn't match your claim Robert. It seems to me Robert, you are making stuff up to rationalize a false teaching of non-OSAS. I can feel your pride.
Why is it so important to preach against once-saved? Because millions of souls are in hell because the church has not done it's job educating the body. While we are out evangelizing the sinners, there are people in our own congregations that are on their way to hell. Why? One good reason is unforgiveness. The Bible is crystal clear that if we don't forgive those who wrong us, then we are not going to receive forgiveness for our own sins, and as a result, we abide in spiritual death.
An unforgiving Christian can't lose eternal life, but he can lose the reward of reigning with Christ during the 1000 years. As I read the Bible nobody has gone to Hell yet. The Antichrist will be the first person that Jesus sends to Hell when He returns to reign on earth for 1000 years.
No murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.
No Christian would have murdered someone. Eternal life can't be lost. It's eternal.
God isn't going to offer you something then turn around and change His mind.
I agree. God is not going to give someone eternal life then take it away. When someone is born-again they can't be unborn.
For I say unto you, That unto every one which hath shall be given; and from him that hath not, even that he hath shall be taken away from him. If a man abide [remain] not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
What is taken away? Any sort of reward though one cannot lose eternal life once received. The Lake of Fire can, indeed, burn off the dross of your false works, but into Hell no Christian shall reside because they have eternal life.
And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. Apparently, the person was in the book of life, in order for God to remove him.
The person isn't removed in this case. A part is taken away, not the entire person, for a person who has eternal life remains saved forever. The tree of life and the holy city are the same here as are spoken of in 22.14. The difference, however, lies in the fact that whereas 22.14 mentions only entering the holy city, 22.18 speaks about having the holy city as one’s portion. None is allowed to add to or to take away from the words of this book. The warning against this is most serious.
I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman [gardener]. Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit. And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Taken away where? To that place of loss of rewards, not loss of life. The servant is still a servant but unprofitable, so he loses the reward in outer darkness which is outside the light of reward of reigning with Christ 1000 years. Weeping indicates sorry for one's self. Gnashing of teeth indicates regret.
The Bible is very clear that a person can be in the Lamb's book of life, and then blotted out, so apparently, even though a person may be in the book of life at one point, it does not mean they will always have that eternal life... yes, it can be taken from them!
Every human being is initially in the book of life. They don't have eternal life until they give their life to Christ. It's a free-choice that has to be played out. One is blotted out by dying without giving one's life to Christ.
Our initial salvation does not require works (we cannot earn our way to heaven), but after we are saved, our faith (if it is genuine) ought to begin to yield fruit of righteousness and goodness in our lives. The Bible goes on to tell us that if our faith does not yield these things, then it is dead: But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? ... Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
If our initial salvation does not require our works or self-strength then neither can we lose it based on these. A faith in Christ but effectively is dead has consequences, but one of those consequences is not loss of life. Man is justified by faith and works: faith for initial salvation, and increased faith and works unto rewards, not loss of life.
What then is the danger of being a non-OSASer? You act like God, self-exalting yourself, creating an arbitrary dividing line that only you agree with works you decide that are good enough. Either you are never sure if you are saved, or if confident that you think you are saved but that Satan always casts doubt that you could lose it. Either way, non-OSAS is a false faith not of God, shared by most other religions of the world, but distinctly not Christian.
Robert L. don't you know right now you are not saved, and you are going to Hell? because you refuse to give your life to the Jesus who keeps and never lets any perish who have died on the cross with Him (John 10.28)? God is infinitely greater than you so no work or act of self-strength can preserve you. If salvation depended on you keeping yourself saved no human being would ever get saved, for all souls eventually would fail.
Self-righteousness and pride of life are at the center of the heart of a non-OSASer. There are lots of you out there starting with the Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox Church and lots of Protestant denominations also, probably over 2 billion. Not a "little flock" (Luke 12.32). Throw yourself into that heaping mess is a sure way to Hell.