In the Beginning God Created......

[Stephen]

In the Begining......

From his window he could watch the blue orb of planet earth getting smaller and smaller. Looming in front of him in all its detail was a giant moon. Astronaut Frank Borman of Apollo 8 was filled with emotion, as he drew closer and closer to the fulfillment of one of man's greatest dreams of landing on the moon.

As the lunar module orbited, the crew could perceive the moon in its pristine state, untouched by human hands, exactly as it left the hands of its Creator. (One could imagine Adam opening his eyes for the first time and viewing a pristine Earth with the same awe.)


Borman wanted to convey this feeling to everyone glued to their TVs and radios, just so they could in some sense share the experience of this milestone in history. What text could express this feeling? What human poet or author could capture in words that awesome feeling of the smallness of man and the vastness of the universe? Only God's Word!

To the ears of billions of earthlings, Borman declared, "In the beginning God created the Heaven and the Earth!" The first chapter of Genesis was read on that historical day to all mankind.

(In contrast to the Russian Cosmonauts who orbited the Earth in Sputnik and proclaimed, "We went to Heaven and didn't find God!") This is the beginning of the story of man and his world.

1) "In the beginning God created Heaven and Earth" (Genesis 1:1). What a contrast between the vast endless heaven containing countless stars, and one tiny speck in the universe called Planet Earth! Yet the following verse begins, "And the Earth was.........." and the rest of the book focuses on Earth.......... Conclusion: God is interested in Earth!

(2) The six days of creation are described in detail. The trees and grass, the animals, fish, birds, and insects. Then was created one human. What a contrast between the vast expanse of planet Earth, and one individual person! Yet from this point on, the bible focuses exclusively on humans (and NOT on the trees or insects)............ Conclusion: God is interested in humanity!

(3) After expounding upon the first human, the bible lists 10 generations with no events recorded. These generations evidently did not interest the author and are only included for the purpose of chronology. Finally we find the passage, "and Noah was a righteous man" (Genesis 6:9), followed by an entire section concerning Noah. ........Conclusion: God is interested in "righteous people"!

(4) This is followed again by a list of names for chronological purposes. Another 10 generations go by, until we come to Abraham our Father. Abraham is 75 years old at the time the Lord speaks of him.

From this point on, the scripture records exclusively the story of Abraham's life and then that of his descendents - right up until the emergence of the Jewish people. The rest of the bible recounts God's relationship with the Jewish people. ...........Conclusion: God is interested in the Jewish people who undertake a unique mission, to be a "light unto the nations," to teach the world about spirituality and our Creator.

Much has been written about the apparent contradiction between the age of the universe, generally accepted by scientists as 15 billion years, and the Jewish tradition of under 6,000 years.

A simple solution which may dispel much confusion: If one accepts the creation of man conceptually, this assumes that the first person was created as an adult, because an infant or child could never survive on his own. It also assumes that trees in full bloom with luscious fruit were available for that first person to eat. Does this contradict the apparent age of the world?

Had a dentist examined Adam's teeth, he would have assumed him to be 30 years old. Had Adam chopped down a tree, he would have counted the rings and proclaimed the tree 100 years old. Had a scientist performed a carbon-14 test, he would have observed a very old universe because God created it in that advanced form.

Conclusion: Conceptually there is no contradiction between scientific calculations and the belief that God created the Universe in full bloom!

s

[The Lost]

Being a biochemist and a a follower of the theory of evolution, i personally do not believe the story of 'creation' to be true. For all of this to have been created in 6 days does not seem logical in my oppinion. What i do believe however, is that God put the foundations down. Over billions of years the planets formed, and eventually on a few select worlds, the correct variables where present (out of billions there is always the probability of a number of planets having the appropiate environment). life was created. I personally have created uni-cellular life in a sealed conical flask by putting the right chemicals into it and heating over a period of a day.

I believe the story in the Bible is a rough guide to explain creation to the masses, it is a step forward. I believe that God has given us the ability to explore and understand, and so move on from the simplified version in the Bible.

Maybe i will be damned for not following the Bible word for word, but i believe God himself has given me the skill to learn, so why not use it, make my own choices using my own free will, and in the end all will be made clear by God himself. I dont believe that God will punish me for using the abilities i have been given.

On a slightly different note, I have a view which you may or may not hold. Many holy writings say that God is Energy and Power, and that God is everywhere with us. Combining science with this theory, everything is made of atoms, which are in turn made of electrons, protons and neutrons, further broken into subunits of quarks and glueons. Everything is energy. So, are we all not part of one God?

[Churchwork]

The Lost,

There is nothing wrong with evolution as long as you accept its limitations studying the physical since the first bacteria or amoeba, and that it can't explain what happened before the amoeba. And it simply is incapable of addressing the soulical and the spiritual, and is limited to the spiritual primarily.

You should believe in creation since nothing in nature happens all by itself; thus, it was caused by the uncreated whom is God of the Bible given Christ.

The Bible does not say the universe was created in 6 days. The Bible says the earth was restored in 6 summary days from the time God made it desolate in Gen. 1.2 and began to restore.

You are arguing against your own misreading of the Bible, which is nonsensical.

Christians believe the universe is 13.7 billion years old. Gen. 2.7 says the "dust" would correspond to this 13.7 billion years.

There is more than a few select worlds with life on them. I don't know how many, but certainly far greater than you would expect. Probabilities dictate this.

You have not jumped the gap from amino acids to at a single celled organism. You are delusional. You would be lying, since no human being has done this. Only God was able to affect this change, which is something he keeps to himself. This is why no human has ever been able to do it, not even those who lie about that they have, lol.

The Bible is a precision instrument for all mankind to receive salvation. It is God's preordained work through Christ to provide salvation and eternal life to any that want it. Those who do not are going to hell. If God did not do this, we would all go to hell. The first saved man was Abel for giving right offering to God.

The Bible in all its vast complexity has not a simple or a comlex version. It is never simpler than we think, but never as complicated either. It is the perfect Word of God without flaw and all that we need for our spirit to affect regeneration by the grace of God. It is truly food for our innerman or innerwoman. God is after your spirit, for unless your spirit is quickened, your mind will never be renewed in its thinking. And you will continue to produce the thoughts you do which are illogical.

If the Bible was so simple, then why would you so easily misread something so simple (as noted above)? It is because, it is not as simple as you think. If something is simple, then you would not err so readily.

The Bible does not say you don't have the skills to learn. But rather, your learning of self is selfish if you reject the one who gave you your self in the first place. You would be living a life of vanity; this is the pride of life.

God made you in His image with a free-will to come to the cross to receive Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior or to reject His forgiveness and gift of eternal life. It is a choice afforded you because giving you this choice gives glory to God. Here is the ultimate conclusion of God's Word...

"Jesus told her, 'I am the resurrection and the life. Those who believe in me, even though they die like everyone else, will live again. and whoever lives and believes in me shall never die. Do you believe this?'" (John 11.25,26).

Obviously since everyone dies, Jesus is talking about eternal life and eternal separation from God. The eternal separation from God is called the second death, perdition, lake of fire, hell, Gehenna. Satan is going there. The fallen angels are going there. The demons are going there. All those who did not receive new life are going there.

When you die you will be resurrected to the Great White Throne after the millennial kingdom to be judged by God. You will listen to God. You won't have a choice. And He will explain all you did and consequently, why you belong in Hell. You will be utterly convinced by God who created you that you in fact belong in Hell, you'll have nothing to say for yourself, then He will put you in Hell to be eternally separated from all those who are His own since there is no sin in the new city and the new earth. This is the objective, which extends even to othe solar systems to leave the solar system we are in.

This was your choice to go to hell by refuse God's loving gift and His Son whom you call a liar. If you wait till after you die, it will be too late.

God is not punishing you for using your abilities. Rather, He needs to separate you from Him and His own for all time because you can't stop calling His Son a liar in your heart. He can see your vanity in your works that you perform indepedently of God whether it be in your high and noble self or your base and ignoble self. Good self or bad self, they are both equally corrupted in the eyes of God because your flesh is corrupted and must die due to the fact that it was born into sin. It can not be refined or fixed; it must perish.

Therefore, there is only one solution to receive God's salvation and to die on the cross with Christ. You are going to die anyway. Whether you die on the cross now or later, it makes all the difference because if you don't die now, you are rejecting your Creator. He does not want to be with those who reject Him.

God is not merely energy or power, for such terms are vague and impersonal. Satan is the author of vagaries and generalities and confusion. God is a Being. He is a Triune Being. He is the Trinity of God the Father, God the Son, and God the Spirit. He was alone in the eternity of the past. There was no other.

God is not within you because God would never indwell a dead spirit. Your spirit is dead to God because your reject his Son. He can't enter your spirit by the Holy Spirit unless your spirit is made new and cleansed for Him to enter.

You would simply be overassuming God is in you. The truth of this mistaken assumption is that the evil spirit is in you. And only God has the power to remove that evil spirit in your spirit through regeneration.

When you speak of energy, you are again, only addressing the physical, not touching on the soulical and the spiritual. What I mean by this that you have in the tiniest part of you in your inner man, even beneath that, the life that is you breathed into you when God breathed His Spirit into the body from "dust" to create your soul life. When the body and the spirit came together your soul emerged. Your spirit was created directly by God and your soul was created indirectly when the body made contact with the spirit. You actually have two lifes in you. Your soul life and your spirit life. Then on top of these is your physical life, where you talk so much about things in the physical realm; your body is included in that realm where you make contact with the world and your environment. Satan will attempt to work from outer to inner, while God's Spirit works from inner to outer. Satan is the god of this world.

When you die this spark of life that is you, does not vanish, but God saves it, like the Bios in your computer or the 1's and 0's, and it is smaller than quarks and glueons and strings. This is your spirit and it will never be annihilated because God made you in His image. It would be unholy and unrighteousness of God to extinguish your spirit and soul. Therefore, if you want to go to Hell and refuse every righteous means possible that God gives to convince you to believe in His Son, then what more can be done?

Whatever God makes in His image, He can never annihilate because that would be unrighteous. This is a vital principle. You are not instrumental value, but intrinsic value to God because God wants to walk with man made in His image for eternity: specifically, those who are saved, which gives glory to God.

God is uncreated. You are not part of God since you were created.

[The Lost]

The Lost,

You have not jumped the gap from amino acids to at a single celled organism. You are delusional. You would be lying, since no human being has done this.



First off, the structure of a typical cell membrance is known as the phospholipid bi-layer. It is composed of phosphates and lipids. When phospholipids are suspended in water they can form a variety of structures. In all cases the hydrophilic phosphate region interacts with water and the hydrophobic fatty acid regions are excluded from water and form hydrophobic interactions. The phospholipid bi-layer also contains integral proteins and colesterol.

So, there is what makes up the first part of the cell. How is energy made in the cell? by the chrystae in the mitochondrions present. How did they get there? they are simple archae bacteriums which are in a symbiotic relationship with the cell. Anyway, back to the DNA. Experiments have shown that by placing the correct amino acids into a solution with enzymes (which occur naturally) dna can be created. Way back when life was being formed, these chemicals would of been free floating in aqueous solutions, and still are.

You say im lying about creation of life in a conical flask? In 1953, a young chemist named Stanley Miller carried out a historic experiment at the University of Chicago. He attempted to recreate the conditions during the Earth's early days by sparking electricity through a mixture of water and gases sealed in a flask. When Miller analysed the results, he was pleased to find traces of amino acids, the building blocks of proteins.

These amino acids have been successfully been found to enter the phospholipid bi-layer within more recent experiments (some using the jokingly named 'alluvial clay' method and in one case in Helsinki they have formed a simple mitochondrion.



But rather, your learning of self is selfish if you reject the one who gave you your self in the first place. You would be living a life of vanity; this is the pride of life.


How is learning about myself in any way vain?!? its vain if i admire myself, but to analyse?? an unobjective analisation is in no way vain.

I will add more later. But i would also like to comment that you are extremely abusive saying i know nothing - but i dont hold a grudge

oh, and if im banned, its because you dont like people thinking outside what the bible defines as right

[Churchwork]

The Lost,

What you have not created is life with a helix. You are an unregenerated biologist, not a Christian biologist.

There has been no recreatable scientific finding of placing amino acids in any order to create DNA; they simply do not come together all by themselves, and we would not even know how to put them together under circumstances billions of years ago. You are lying. It is a bold face lie. If you can not stop lying blatantly, what can be done but to ban you? since the conversation would be under false pretences.

God can combine elements such as these, but you can not. God made this beyond human understanding. This is why you can only lie that you did it, but no scientific journal and no scientific community has been able to do it. It would be on the news every night. There would be books flying off the shelves. If it were so, it would be the greatest finding in the history of the human race.

Proteins and amino acids are one thing. Moving from there to a helix is entirely something else. That is the part where God will never allow man to understand how He did that.

Learning about yourself is not vain, but doing so while calling Jesus a liar, means you are doing it from a point of lack and self-centered gain, always without God's life aiding you and against God's will for He wants you to learn about yourself from the new creation, not the old creation. The fallen nature will always cloud your judgment.

When you lie as you have done, this is very abusive. Don't come onto this forum and lie to people claiming you have created a single celled organism. This is very unethical. I can't stress this enough.

I did not say you "know nothing", so why accuse me of saying this? This is itself abusive when you sin bearing false witness as that great false accuser.

The reason you are close to being banned is not because you disagree with the Bible and call Jesus a liar per se, since I am here to lead you to Christ; but, it is because you are getting abusive, making false accusations, and lying about creating a single celled organism. This is utter belligerency and obstinacy.

I know you want to think you are going to be banned because you disagree with the Bible, but as we have seen, that is not going to be the reason.

[Churchwork]

The Lost,

On second thought, you will just try to rationalize yourself further, so in order to not incite your flesh, and not be the cause for your not coming to Christ, you are banned. Don't be a dullard!

However, I will pray for you to come to the cross as a helpless sinner to receive Jesus as your Lord and Savior. :)

[Simba]

Hello, my name is Simba. Im new to this site and this was one of the first conversations read. Please excuse if i make mistakes, i am learning still english.Back in Germany i have heard conversations on news and read in papers about this. I dont think 'The Lost' was telling lies when he said life can be made in a bottle. But i dont beliebe that he made because God makes life. I think he just put the matreils into place so that God could make happen.Howcome he is banned? i dont want to speak things which you dont like and get banned myself

[Churchwork]

Why ask this question since the answer was already given?

"The Lost" said "I personally have created uni-cellular life in a sealed conical flask by putting the right chemicals into it and heating over a period of a day".

No scientist in the world has done this. This requires a helix strand of DNA which is vastly complicated which is a million mile leap from amino acids. It would be like finding one grain of sand on earth, and I didn't tell you where it was.

He repeated himself like a clanging bell, "Experiments have shown that by placing the correct amino acids into a solution with enzymes (which occur naturally) dna can be created".

There has been no experiments that have been able to accomplish this, nor could he show any.

Self-declarations don't count.

We can be fairly confident God reserved this information for himself about how He did it. It dumfounds us, even the greatest minds on the planet.

Those who want to play God will lie to you about creating life from amino acids.

[Stephen]

In Jns gospel ch.2 Jesus attends a wedding. They are out of wine. Jesus gives instructions that water pots be filled with water, and then these water pots be carried out to the wedding banquet. Those who drank of this water said, this is the best wine.

What year?? Vintage?? Grape??

Jesus did it. In a few moments.

This is the God of the bible. Billions of years??? Nothing is too hard for the Master.

The God of the bible cannot be contained in human thought. We have to accept the revealed word of God..............or perish

s