AtheistExperience
Re: http://www.youtube.com/user/AtheistExperience?blend=2&ob=1
Of course atheism is an ideology. It means something, not nothing, that's an idea. It does make assertions, that God does not exist, but since God is proven, therefore atheism is false. Atheism is the word in the English language to say there is no God whether you think you have evidence or not for your opinion. A lack of belief for or against God is called agnosticism. You're confusing terms. I realize the trend these last many years due to atheists being embarrassed in their stance but still want to be atheists are trying to change the meaning of atheism to agnosticism so they can still keep calling themselves atheists, but what that reveals to me about you guys is your conscience is speaking but you are not listening to it.Originally Posted by AtheistExperience
You're confusing that which looks like nothing but is still something with actually nothing that which does not exist. Since the universe can't come from the latter nothing nor always have existed then the ultimate cause is the uncreated Creator if you want to be logical about it.- "obviously something can't come from nothing"
Well... maybe that is not so obvious. I am not a quantum physicist, so I can't explain it in detail, but Stephen Hawking and a co-writer recently published a new book that explains how our universe (and possibly other universes) could have appeared out of seemingly nothing. Apparently "nothing" is an unstable state that automatically has to become something else; not because a God has a specific intention with that, but just because the laws of nature and quantum mechanics make it do that.
That's a very popular video being passed around. I have seen it many times before and watched it all once. Just because you don't know the cause to why those particles come into your viewing range is no reason to think they come into existence from nothing. That's quackery. Scientists don't close up shop at that point and say there is no more cause to be found. How silly. There are trillions of causes in nature and no reason to think something comes from nothing. Actually that video gets really weird. Krauss tries to postulate the universe is nothing and comes from nothing because he says all things balance out to zero. That's just one big fat assumption and a contradiction since the universe would not exist if it was nothing.Again, I am not an expert on this, and I find it hard to visualize such things, but at the quantum level particles just seem to pop in and out of existence, so "something out of nothing" seems to be happening all the time. If you are interested in a lecture about the current scientific ideas, you can watch "A Universe from Nothing" by Lawrence Krauss here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ImvlS8PLIo
Blah Blah blah. Probably already refuted somewhere else? If you can't show it, then you are just assuming.- "if there was an eternity of the past of cause and effects, there would have been an eternity to do so, so it would have happened already. Yet here we are."
It's 3:30 a.m. for me, yet here I am, but I'm a little bit tired, so I'll just assume that this is a "first cause" argument that might have been used by William Lane Craig, and that is probably already refuted somewhere else. I think that TruthfulChristian2 or someone like that also made a video with a similar argument. There was also a response video which showed why that argument was wrong. I don't remember where I saw that, but I remember that the argument was wrong.
Since it can't be natural, it is supernatural. No other option exists, and you don't need to wait for eternity to find out, otherwise arrogantly you are claiming you have to be like God all-knowing to know. Obviously you will never be all-knowing. That there is no other option is not an argument from ignorance since it is evidenced in the fact that it can't be natural. Argument from ignorance is claiming what I am telling you is true because you can't disprove it. That is not the approach I take. The reason the uncreated Creator exists is because of the evidence nature can't always have existed or come from nothing. And since you can't find a naturalistic explanation for the origin of the disciples' beliefs that is so well testified, then this proves who the supernatural uncreated Creator is.- "Therefore, since no other naturalistic explanation is forthcoming, we are left inextricably with the necessity of the uncreated Creator."
This seems to be an argument from ignorance. You are basically saying, "you don't have another explanation, so my explanation must be right," and "we don't know what else it could be, so let's call it God or the Creator." That is all very nice, but that still doesn't prove that Atheism or not believing in any gods is wrong, because even if there is such a Creator, we still don't know who Creator is and what He wants, if anything.
You're encouraged to compare claims on who the uncreated Creator is for which one will come forth triumphant. You know Islam is wrong not only because it has no evidence for its god like we have for God of the Bible by the resurrection proof, but also because it falsifies itself since the Koran teaches Jesus never died on the cross nor was even taken to the cross. Making this claim six centuries later is absurd and contrary to all the evidence we do have in the first century. Hinduism's Brahma is false because it is an amoral god. How can the Creator have morals below our own? As to other gods, compare them one by one, and you will see not only are they not well testified, but they are unprovable, since you don't receive any hard data like we have from the eyewitness testimonies in various group settings and a strong religio-historical context of 40 authors over 1500 years in agreement to produce 66 inspired books. An impersonal absentee landlord is evil, so God who personally enters His creation and makes Himself accessible is better. for God's morality can't fall below His created beings. Imagining things is not a valid approach. It is the evidence that in all Paul's travels in setting up the churches with other Apostles that his foundation was real in what he wrote in 1 Cor. 15, Gal. 1 & 2, so these are clearly Paul's words, testimony and genuine beliefs. Read those 3 chapters by Paul.You may say that the Creator is the Christian god God, but the Muslims can say that it's Allah, the Hindus can say that it's Brahma, and the ancient Egyptians could have said that it was Amun, or whatever. Pantheists might say that that Creator only created the universe and then left it alone. You could even imagine a creative goddess who died in the process of giving birth to our universe, or universe-creating pixies.
That is crazy I agree that God could feel lonely since that is inadequacy, so since we both agree it is crazy and certainly not evidenced at all, it can hardly compare to the multiple eyewitness testimony of the original disciples having seen Jesus alive from the dead in various group settings. It's really quite simple when you get down to it. The Creator would be accessible so that leaves only Christianity, not even Islam or Hinduism. The rest are minuscule in comparison. Since Islam and Hinduism are shown to be false, then that leaves Christianity only. Even if you didn't know anything about it, you know it would have to be true since no other option exists.The ancient Egyptians believed that the first god felt so lonely that he created everything by masturbating and then impregnating his own self-created mother in order to be reborn as his own son... or something like that. (Don't try this at home!)
You can make the story as crazy as you want, because even if you assume that there had to be a Creator, you still can't make the link from that Creator to a specific god and a specific religion. Even if there was such a Creator, how do we know what He/She/It wants from us?
And how do we know that He/She/It is still present in our universe? Why should such a god even want to be inside of this universe anyway, if He/She/It could also live without it? Let's think of the Creator as a watchmaker, and let's think of our universe as a carefully designed watch? Why would the designer crawl inside of that watch and check every cogwheel, if He could also wind it up, put it away and just let it tick?
So, to make a long story short, even it there is an "uncreated Creator," we still don't know who that is, or what the Creator wants from us, if anything. What are that Creator's intentions? Does the Creator even have intentions, or could the Creator be a blind and spastic child that accidentally makes things? There are so many possibilities that the idea of a Creator still doesn't explain much. Why should we worship and pray to that Creator, if He/She/It may not even care about us? And how do we know all that?
How do we know what God wants from us? He reveals it to us in His word, the 66 books of the Bible.
The uncreated Creator is always existing. We know He is omnipresent, able to touch all points at any time in the universe because He exists outside of time. Why does God want to enter His creation? Because He loves us and does not want us to go to Hell like you have your heart set on. So He died on the cross for the sins of the world to save whosoever is willing. God expresses His glory and does so in a perfect creation. God is relational in His Triune Being, so making us in His image is for Him to have fellowship with. Surely that gives God more glory than God doing nothing. God would be perfect in all He does always. Always righteous, holy and true. Since God cares about us as evident by what Jesus did for us on the cross, then He is worthy of your praise and worship.
Lee Strobel's book, The Case for Christ, pp. 266-267 So what? What difference does this make? There are several obvious implications.
1) If Jesus is the Son of God, his teachings are more than just good ideas from a wise teacher; they are divine insights on which I can confidently build my life.
2) If Jesus sets the standard of morality, I can now have an unwavering foundation for my choices and decisions, rather than basing them on the ever-shifting of expediency and self-centeredness.
3) If Jesus did rise from the dead, he's still alive today and available for me to encounter on a personal basis.
4) If Jesus conquered death, he can open the door to eternal life for me, too.
5) If Jesus has divine power, he has the supernatural ability to guide me and help me and transform me as I follow him.
6) If Jesus personally knows the pain of loss and suffering, he can comfort and encourage me in the midst of the turbulence that he himself warned is inevitable in a world corrupted by sin.
7) If Jesus loves me as he says, he has my best interest at heart. That means I have nothing to lose and everything to gain by committing myself to him and his purposes.
8) If Jesus is who he claims to be (and remember, no leader of any other major religion has ever pretended to be God), as my Creator he rightfully deserves my allegiance, obedience, and worship.
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