Trying to Keep Yourself Saved

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12-12-2010, 07:24 PM
Parture

Trying to Keep Yourself Saved

Re: Providential1611 (YouTube)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Providential1611

You cannot "unsave" me with your pontifications! You appear to suffer from a God-complex. You cannot affect my salvation with your stupid words. I am born again and washed by the precious blood of the Lamb. The fact that you are a Once-Saved-Awlays-Saved ranter, since you believe in your heretical doctrine of Security-in-sin, since you are an antinomian, I suggest you focus on Christ and His word, and leading people to the Lord. You can never convince me of the heretical Calvinist doctrine of Once Saved Always Saved.

The precious blood of the Lamb once-saves-always-saves. Since you don't want this salvation as the future continues and as you approach eternity, eventually you turn away from your faith having an eternity do so since no man can keep himself saved.

John 10.28 is clear as can be, those who are born-again, "they shall never perish."

You have a God-complex thinking you can keep yourself saved and thus save yourself to begin with. You were never born-again to begin with. It's easy to see.

Those who truly gave their lives to Christ gave their lives to the God who keeps and continues to work in us unto perfection. For those Christians who want to remain carnal in the interim, though they cannot lose eternal life, they will lose the reward of returning with Christ to reign during the millennium.

You are hard like Calvinists but in a different way. You're hard like the Roman Church non-OSASers always trying to work for their salvation. You work for your salvation because you could lose it any minute; whereas a Calvinist works hard because he doesn't really know if he was saved or not because it was never his choice according to his assumption of irresistible grace. Both are unsaved.

As Dave Hunt would say that would be a weird kind of salvation if you could get saved, lose it, get it back, to only lose it again. God simply won't waste his time with you. He simply won't save you to begin with, thus, you are unsaved.

Antinomianism is thinking you are saved without consequences. Of course that is not what I believe since I believe in the millennial kingdom, time of recompense, and loss of rewards for carnal Christians. 1000 years is a long time to spend in "outer darkness" outside the light of reward of reigning with Christ during the millennium.

When I tell you that you are not born again I am "focusing on Christ and His word, and leading you to Christ." Mentioning Hell is part of the Gospel. Who better to speak about Hell than you since you are under a false salvation?

I am not trying to convince you of Calvinism OSAS since that is false. There are two kinds of OSAS. The OSAS of Calvinism is where their god irresisistily imposes salvation on them into a salvation they can never get out of. Whereas Christians (OSAS Arminians) are saved by giving their lives to Christ asking God to keep us because we could never keep ourselves saved as you try to do in your self-strength.

Here are many more verses for OSAS,

http://biblocality.com/forums/faq.ph...#faq_question7

My prayers sincerely go out to you to yet give your life to Christ one day. Amen.
12-14-2010, 10:32 AM
Parture

I know this is hard to understand providential but just as those Calvinists are not saved nor are you because you are Wesleyan. Paul Washer is going to Hell with James White and Roman Catholics.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Providential1611

You don't seem very bright. Belief in Once Saved Always Saved is not essential to salvation. What needs to be believed is spelled out in 1Cor 15:1-4, and your doctrine is not there, and ironically enough, Paul DENIES you doctrine there ands asserts the opposite--how people who believed can believe in vain IF they don't continue in it. God has called me clean, and you cannot make me unclean. You need to stop posing as a theologian, because you surely are not one.

1 Cor. 15 says "you have believed in vain" because you reject what was "preached unto you" that those who are born-again "they shall never perish (John 10.28). This is how I know you are going to Hell. To enter into an eternal salvation that can never be lost one must enter "conditionally"; in other words, receive the God who keeps in humility not thinking you can keep yourself saved for that is arrogance. Following is unto rewards, not loss of life. You're trying to trick God.

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Like I said, you're not too bright. There is NOTHING in 1Cor.15 about believing your doctrine. Paul lists what needs to be believed. So now you are engaging in deliberate deception--LYING, and so your true colors manifest. And your incessant reference to John 10:28 actually undermines your position, which is unconditional salvation. But right in Christ's statements are TWO CONDITIONS cited--listening and following. To them eternal life is given, not to one-trick ponies

The Bible says there are false Christs. You worship a false Christ. You gave your life to an impotent god that can't keep you saved. I know you never gave your life to Christ because those who are born-again receive eternal life that is eternal, can never be lost, but since you say it can be lost you show you don't have that sense of eternal life in you. On the contrary you believe you could lose salvation which is diabolically opposed to God's life in the saints.

"Unless ye have believed in vain" (1 Cor. 15.2), then you were not saved. "If ye keep in memory what I preached unto you" (v.2). You have not kept in memory what was preached for John 10.28 says "I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish." So you have rejected what Jesus preached, thus you believe in vain and are not saved. You never were saved. Paul confirms as well in many verse a person cannot lose salvation. Therefore, God calls you unclean and false.

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And you are going to heaven? You are saved? I'm sorry, but everyone I ever met who banished nearly everyone from salvation and heaven was actually not saved and part of a cult of some sort. SInce I trust in Christ, who saved me, saves me and WILL save me, since His precious blood washed my sin away and since I have been born again and live for HIm and not for sin anymore, what are you saying to me? God is for me, even if you are against me.

You are not saved and banish yourself because you refuse to give your life to the God who keeps. Those who are born-again "they shall never perish (John 10.28), therefore, you are not born-again. Do not fret though, simply give your life to this God now and so shall you be saved. Praise the Lord! Amen.

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1Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; 2By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. 3For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; 4And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

"And it is this Good News that saves you if you firmly believe it [those born-again "shall never perish" John 10.28]--unless, of course, you believed something that was never true in the first place [a person could lose salvation]" (1 Cor. 15.2).

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LIke I said, you need a course in logic. Paul Washer believes in your erronoues doctrine of Once Saved always Saved--so according to YOU, He is saved simply for believing that doctrine. LOL. But you have somehow managed to damn him anyway. But since you don't mind being deceptive, you continue to insert John 10:28 into 1Cor 15 as a condition when it is not. You REFUSE to LIST WHAT PAUL SAID WAS NECESSARY to believe, and insert your own idea. FALSE GOSPEL.

I don't think a course in logic could help you because you could be taught by the best logicians on the world and you will still refuse what they have to say, for the flesh can rationalize anything. Paul Washer believed in a false version of OSAS, that is to say, he believed he was irresistibly made to be regenerated and unable to escape it. Whereas Christians (OSAS Arminians) are once-saved-always-saved, because that is who we gave our lives to to keep us in humility knowing we can't keep ourselves saved like you think you can keep yourself saved in your own strength and pride. I already said several times Paul Washer was not saved so who you do say I say otherwise? Paul Washer refuses to give his life to the God who keeps by erecting an idol called Total depravity which says he can't. And you refuse to give your life to the God who keeps by self-exalting yourself that you keep yourself saved. No man can do that. Eventually you will fall away from your own faith.

Paul taught OSAS so it's part of 1 Cor. 15. Is Jesus a liar when he said those who are born-again "they shall never perish"? You're not really accusing me but God Almighty. Paul listed what is needed to be saved which you reject so you worship a false Christ and are under a false salvation, a false gospel.

Paul Washer is going to Hell since he is a Calvinist and so is Providential1611: "And it is this Good News that saves you if you firmly believe it [the born-again "shall never perish" John 10.28]--unless, of course, you believed something that was never true in the first place [a person could lose salvation]" (1 Cor. 15.2).

You don't want to believe in this Christ and that makes me very sad for you. As Paul said,

"Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away. Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time" (1 Pet. 1.3-5).

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This is nonsense. Now, lets try again and see if FACTS can enter your cranium: One's view on whether a Christian can fall away and perish is not relevant to salvation itself. Christ requires repentance and faith. And once that takes place, GOD FORGIVES AND REGENERATES that soul. Who are you to say otherwise and put stumblingblocks in the way? Well, you are like the Pharisees Christ condemned for doing that very thing. Ironically OSAS is a SATANIC DOCTRINE.

Giving your life to a God where you can keep your salvation is worshiping a false Christ. This is either salvation by works or being saved by your own strength. So obviously, you are not saved as you would need to give your life to the God who keeps. Just like you, most Roman Catholics are unsaved. Salvation is not by works, lest any man should boast. Imagine yourself on your pedestal in Hell declaring to all the others in Hell, you keep yourself saved. Could anything be more psychotic?

I believe salvation requires repentance and faith and once that takes place God forgives and regenerates that soul, so why be like Satan and accuse that I don't? You put up your own stumbling block, for you admit you refuse to repent and believe in the God who keeps because you rely on your own strength instead. You are like the Pharisees Christ condemned because they too did not want to give their lives to God of the Bible either. Non-OSAS is a Satanic doctrine of the great harlot of religious Rome to control people in their system and to pride themselves over others. When eternal life is given at new birth, it is eternal, can never be lost, for the Holy Spirit to indwell. Obviously, you don't have this sense of life.

As Dave Hunt would say, that would be a weird kind of salvation if you could get saved, lose it, get it back again only to lose it again. God is no fool! He simply won't save you to begin with. So you were never born-again. How sad for you.
12-14-2010, 04:52 PM
Parture

Quote:

Originally Posted by Providential1611

No. You MISREPRESENT not only what I believe, but your own position as well!!!

I am glad you can't show it. You confess you refuse to give your life to the God who keeps, so you think you can lose salvation tomorrow. What a pathetic god.

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"The Bible"does not say "those who are born again shall never perish". Produce that statement or ADMIT it does not say that.

"My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand" (John 10.27-29). Those who are born-again have eternal life. Why do you reject God's word? Obviously, you are not His sheep and probably never will be.

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And since you like to put words in my mouth--absurd ones, and therefore engage in strawman tactics, you prove yourself utterly unworthy of any kind of discussion, seeing you cannot honor the God you claim to serve by being honest and telling the truth. So far all you have been able to do is tell one lie after another. Keep it up and you will find out that ALL LIARS will have their part in the Lake of Fire(Rev 21:8). It doesn't matter what you claim to believe, God wrote that verse for people who think like you--deluded religious hypocrites who think that because they are Christian, they can lie and get away with it. That is why God said ALL LIARS--Christian or not, ALL LIARS will suffer the wrath of God. You will not escape, unless you repent and learn how to speak honestly.

I am glad you couldn't show any lie, so why be like Satan accusing falsely? You are lying then, so what will happen to you according to your own position on lying? "...all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death" (Rev. 21.8). You've admitted, therefore, you are going to Hell. How sad for you.

In your entire attempt to accuse, never once did you show any specific lie. God makes a liar out of you then. Satan is that great accuser who accuses day and night, vaguely and falsely, just like you, so you take after him. You're a bad guy teaching like Satan and the Roman Church a person could lose salvation tomorrow. You're sick!

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You don't know WHAT I believe, nor do you know WHY I believe it, and worse, you don't care to trouble yourself to know either so you can discuss this knowledgably and factually. Instead you make one false accusation after another, showing you don't know what you are talking about, and you continue in this SINFUL WAY, arguing to be right rather than righteous. I see why people of such immoral character such as yourself need a false doctrine to feel safe and secure---you are a sinner, a religious hypocrite who needs a SECURITY-IN-SIN doctrine to quell the pangs of conscience. You are only deceiving yourself.

You told me you could potentially lose salvation tomorrow. That was a lot of babble talk all to try to cover up the fact you reject once-saved-always-saved no matter how many verses are given to you that show a person cannot lose salvation if they are born-again. You are obviously simply too selfish to give your life to the God who keeps pridefully thinking you can keep yourself saved, lose it, get it back again, lose it again and on and on of your own strength. You're delusional and going to Hell. There is no doubt about it. There is no comfort in the security of sin entering a false salvation that you want to be under a god who can relieve you an hour later of eternal life. That was a selfish salvation from the get go.

"For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord" (Rom. 8.38-39). You say you can be separated from the love of God. I say you can be separated because you were never born-again to begin with. How sad for you, living a lie, not giving your life to the God who keeps.

"And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?" (John 11.26). It does not say "whosoever keeps on believing for eternity shall never die." If that were true nobody would ever remain saved, since everyone would eventually fall away because nobody is strong enough to keep themselves saved.