• Universalism

    by Published on 08-02-2016 04:20 PM     Number of Views: 227 
    1. Categories:
    2. Hell,
    3. Atheist, Agnostic, Agtheist,
    4. Universalism,
    5. Spiritual Warfare

    This will be interesting to see if anyone answers this thread.

    Let's say you know someone who claims to believe in Jesus but never gives the gospel of salvation to anyone, not even in the slightest. There is no compassion or empathy or concern by them for others who are perishing. They never go to Church. It's as if Jesus does not exist even though they claim to believe in Him when challenged. If everyone who was saved was like this there would be no Church.

    It's as if they know what we want to hear from them to believe in Jesus. But they are not willing to go so far as to say people who reject Christ are going to Hell even though Jesus spoke on Hell more than anyone and the gospel of salvation is clear if you don't accept Christ you will go to Hell. That's the gospel, or at least part of the gospel.

    They have never read the Bible. So they could care less Jesus said, "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish [not go to Hell], but have everlasting life" (John 3.16).

    On top of that, prior to you yourself being saved, that fake Christian never brought up Christ even once. And even today they still don't. You would have to start the discussion always. You may have known them for decades. They may have accused you of being a "fanatic" when you first gave your life to Christ. How in the world is that accepting a new member of the body of Christ? Now all of a sudden years after you were saved they claim they themselves were saved all along. Then why did they never bring Christ up? I have never known such evil before!

    This same person also lashes out or gets angry every time you call them out for not being a Christian because they don't accept the Jesus who sends people to Hell, particularly family members and close relatives who reject Christ. Does that not strike you as a self-centered faith? All things center on them, because by virtue of them claiming to be saved everyone in their sphere of influence is saved, but outside that sphere others are not necessarily saved. Total lunacy!

    I am sure there is a better name for it, but I call this Fake Pseudo-Universalism Christianity because everyone is saved in their sphere of influence even if there are those in the sphere who reject Christ or call themselves atheists, agnostic, deist or adamantly state they don't believe in religion. I always thought true religion is true and false religion is false...but for them all religion is false. The center-man or center-woman declares anti-religious people are saved as well since they live next door or near to them.

    What kind of evil salvation would that be if people outside your sphere of influence are not saved, but in your sphere everyone is saved? They are playing God. If they are already saved, no wonder why you don't need to give them the gospel! So what happens is they don't hear the gospel of salvation because this centerpiece person deems them automatically saved. Therefore, they end up perishing never hearing the gospel. How can someone be so selfish to cater to one's own feelings like this at the expense of others? It's all for the purpose of satisfying their own flesh to pretend others are protected as long as they remain within the sphere of this self-centered person. They aim to draw people to themselves like a cult. It's totally selfish and self-serving, and this person makes themselves the center of it all.

    They don't want to hear anything negative that people are going to Hell for rejecting Christ so they reject the gospel of salvation and certainly don't share it with anyone. Because this turns people off to mention Hell they never mention Hell or the need of salvation from Hell. They turn into mini-Joel Osteen's. Something is definitely rotten here! They are themselves being negative because they mock Jesus. Jesus died for people. To claim someone is saved even though they reject Jesus has the false appearance of being positive, but it is really negative because it mocks the cross of Jesus Christ and the shedding His precious blood for forgiveness of sins. If someone is saved anyway then Jesus died for no reason. If Jesus died for no reason is that not negative? God wasted His blood. It is rejecting God's very plan of salvation. How can anything be more negative than that?

    Crazy world eh? The crap we have to put with in the world by false Christians is insanely disturbing. Might I also add Christians need to be "wiser" towards men because non-Christians are always on the lookout to make the Christian look bad. Make no mistake about it! I have experienced this many times. You know someone is not a Christian when you mention the full gospel of salvation and they produce their outburst on queue and lash out like in this case study.

    by Published on 01-27-2016 03:26 PM     Number of Views: 308 
    1. Categories:
    2. LDS/Mormons,
    3. Atheist, Agnostic, Agtheist,
    4. Universalism

    FairMormon.Org

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael LeCheminant
    These are my opinions and do not necessarily represent FairMormon or the LDS church.

    In monotheism of Christianity God was alone from everlasting and nothing beside God (no nature/matter/intelligences/material/etc), but not in Mormonism.
    This statement is not Biblical. Do you have a scriptural reference for why you believe this? When you say that God was alone, do you mean the Father, the Son, or the Holy Spirit, or all three of them? Genesis chapter 1 says "let us make man in our image." The ancient Jews believed (as Mormons do) that in the beginning there was a council of gods.
    The Jews did not believe in a council of gods. They believed there were no such thing as gods, they were just idols made up by men. Elohim is the Trinity; if not then simply speaking of majesty.

    The law of the conservation of mass states that mass cannot be created or destroyed. This fits with the Mormon belief that God organized existing matter to create the universe. Some essence of our being has always existed.
    The law of conservation of mass allows for God who is infinitely great to bring things into being from Himself so nature did not always need to exist as you surmised. No essence of your being ever existed before God created you. By placing yourself alongside God feeds pride and debases God to a lesser being so you don't receive salvation from God who is optimally great.

    Mormons believe that all people are spirit children of God and that we lived with him before we were born. I find this to be a wonderful teaching that makes sense to me as well as a number of non-Mormons I have talked to, and it is hinted at several times in the Bible, yet no other church believes it. You are correct that Mormon belief is different from traditional Christianity. That is why we send missionaries throughout the world to share our message with everyone we can.
    It's never hinted at in the Bible we lived with God before being born. It's simply the romance of the gods such as Zeus and the gods of eastern religions. It's a way to exalt self. Whereas Christianity is monotheistic, that is to say, God was alone from everlasting before time and space in His 3 Persons. As the Bible says there is none beside Him, and no gods after Him. What you are doing to yourself is rejecting the atonement of Christ because you have turned Jesus into a lesser being who can never save. Only the uncreated Creator has that power to redeem. Since you are sending missionaries out, you are sending men to their doom and others. And isn't that Satan's ultimate objective? The Church did not disappear for 18 centuries.

    And there was nothing beside God before time and space.
    I believe that God is a physical being who interacts with others, and therefore he must exist in time and space. It makes no sense to me that it could be otherwise.
    Since the Bible says God the Father is spirit and that you can't see Him then He is not a physical being. He can and does exist outside of time and space in the Trinity. This is not so hard to understand as you think. Think of yourself as a stick figure on a piece of paper. He can see 2 dimensions. A cube is 3 dimensions. So when the cube is presented, the stick figure can only see one side or a square. He doesn't see the full cube (he can't) because the cube is in 3 dimensions. So it is with the 3 Persons of the Trinity. There is the other problem posed of your faith that if God the Father was once a man who became a God and the God that created that man was once a man, and this goes on ad infinitum in the past, you have the same problem atheists have because if there was this infinite regress of cause and effects, you would have happened already having had an eternity to do so. So nature needs a cause outside of itself, outside of time and space, being uncreated. This uncreated Creator, the Trinity, is whom we call God. Mormons are really supernatural atheists.

    And Jesus created all things, being God (John 1.1) in the Trinity.
    I agree that Jesus is God and created the world under the direction of his Father.
    Jesus didn't just create the world, He created all things. He didn't even create only on the instruction of the Father for John 1.3 says "All things were made by him." Always remember, you redefine what God is so you don't agree that Jesus is God. God is not multiple beings. That's if anything polytheism. God is one Being. That's traditional monotheism even in other faiths. Evil the Devil knows God is One Being. There are not some things Jesus did not create. He created all things so there cannot be these things you call material/matter/intelligences that always existed alongside God.

    So how can the Jesus of Mormonism be the Jesus of Christianity?
    The Jesus of Mormonism is God incarnate who was born to the virgin Mary, worked many mighty miracles such as healing the sick and raising the dead, taught many important things such as those found in the Sermon on the Mount, and then suffered for all of our sins, was crucified on the cross, buried in a tomb, and was the first to be resurrected. He is our Savior and Redeemer and the Messiah. Is this this the same Jesus that you believe in?
    The reason why your Jesus is not the same Jesus because you redefine all these terms, but don't tell people until later. Jesus God incarnate is not a separate being from the Father or the Spirit. They are One Being in 3 Persons, co-equal like Phil. 2 says, co-inherent, one substances, each Person distinct, but not separate. Whereas your incarnation is relegated to being something alongside God in the eternity of the past. Surely you can see God alone from everlasting in His 3 Persons is all-knowing, all-powerful and everywhere present when He cannot be if He is limited by material/matter/intelligences that always existed also and if He was not alone before time and space. See the problem? It's not solvable because Mormonism is just a cult that came 18 centuries later. And so you are receiving an atonement that lacks the all-inclusiveness and effectiveness in Christ.

    Lastly, in Christianity when a person is born-again they can never go to Hell, but in Mormonism after being saved you can still go to Hell as an apostate Mormon and your works determine which heaven you go to.
    Most Christians do not believe in the Calvinist teaching of "once saved, always saved" (perseverance of the Saints), and there is no Biblical evidence for this, so Mormons reject it as do many other Christians. Only a certain segment of Protestants believe this. I'm curious as to your reason for believing it. Just because a person starts on the path toward God does not mean that they can't choose to leave that path and reject God. I have seen this happen countless times.
    Christians are not Calvinists. We know that Calvinists are going to Hell. But you are overlooking OSAS that is not Calvinistic, but OSAS Arminian. In other words, instead of being once saved always saved irresistibly a person can be once saved always saved by giving their lives to the God who keeps, for we don't even have in our own strength once saved to keep ourselves. saved. So John 10.28 says, "And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand." As an aside Calvinists are confused because they teach "perseverance" which is works; they are suppose to believe in irresistible works. What you are teaching is what the Roman Catholic Church teaches, that great harlot of religious Rome that makes drunk the nations with the wine of the wrath of her fornications. Roman Catholics are Remonstrants. But the Bible teaches salvation is not by works lest anyone should boast. So there are not different heavens to go to based on your works. What you have seen countless times is a person who was never saved to begin with because if it was real it would have remained. Christians are not Remonstrants like you and the RCC, but nor are we Calvinists. We are the ones who were killed by the Roman Catholic Church and by that Protestant Pope of Geneva John Calvin. We are a "little flock" (Luke 12.32). The RCC is a great harlot, Mormons are a little harlot. Technically though Mormons are not even in Christendom. Many in Christendom are not saved, but Mormons are not even in that sphere as they are so aberrant.

    Mormons have a very different concept of hell as compared to traditional Christianity, and I believe that virtually all people who have every lived on the earth will eventually go to heaven. The Bible makes it very clear that we should live our lives according to the commandments God has given us. As we do so, we will become more like Christ and we will be blessed and rewarded as we follow him. That does not mean that we can save ourselves through our works.
    I don't believe most Mormons believe in Universalism for they do believe that Hell is a place of eternal separation from God even though in Mormonism very few go there. This speaks to the low standards in Mormonism if almost everyone is saved. But you believe in Universalism which has major problems such as you will be sharing a bunk bed with Hitler, Stalin, Mao, rapists and other sadistic evil people who never repent. Firstly, the Bible teaches there is no rest day or night forever in Hell where the worm never dies. Secondly, free will is not truly free if you don't have the free choice to reject God. Once resurrected a person will not change their mind. That's why I have never met anyone past the age of 40 (though there may be a few) who ever gave their life to Christ because they had more than enough time. Before you can receive this new life and work in that new life, you need to be born-again. The only way for you to be born-again is if you accept who Jesus truly is and receive what He did for you. You don't actually receive what He did for you turn Him into a false Christ and a lesser being which, of course, is what you have done.

    But in Christianity, works don't save or give you a standing in the pillars of the New City.
    I don't understand this statement. Maybe you can clarify.
    After the millennial kingdom, rewards are done away with. Everyone will be where they belong in the New City so it would be unjust to have multiple different heavens as in Mormonism. It reeks survival of the fittest. There is only one heaven and Rev. 21 heaven and earth come together in the New City on the New Earth. Period. There is one thing I haven't told you about, about who lives outside the New City on the New Earth who go through the 12 gates to receive renewal from the Tree of Life, but I will save that for another time.

    Works in Christianity only are rewarded when Jesus returns to reign over the nations for 1000 years.
    I agree that judgment day will occur after the second coming of Christ during or after his Millennial reign. But I have a question for you. If you believe that you are going to heaven, and you believe that you will be rewarded for your works, as you state here, do you believe that different people will receive different levels of rewards? If so, doesn't that mean that there will be different levels of heaven? Earlier you criticized Mormons for believing this, but it sounds like you must believe the same thing. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
    Judgment Seat is for Christians when He returns. The Great White Throne is after the millennial kingdom and judges the unsaved. Paul distinguishes spiritual and carnal Christians. Spiritual Christians receive the reward of returning (Jude 14,15) with Christ to reign over the nations (Rev. 2.26,27) for 1000 years (20.4-6). Think of that reward being presidents, prime ministers, ministers, ombudsmen, even head of businesses because knowledge is not as important as conscience. A better conscience in charge makes things run better. The millennial kingdom is not heaven. This is why the millennial kingdom is called the "time of recompense".

    I can't get Mormonism to agree with Christianity.
    If by Christianity you mean traditional Christianity of the Catholic, Orthodox, or one of the many Protestant varieties, then I would absolutely agree with you! Mormonism is not the same as traditional, creedal Christianity. We make the claim that we are more similar to the original Christianity as taught by Jesus and his apostles than any other church, and there is much evidence to support this view. We are a restoration of the ancient church in these latter days, and since we definitely believe in Jesus Christ, we definitely consider ourselves to be Christians.
    Think of an orthodox Christianity that sticks with the Bible, after all the Bible says don't say "I of Cephas" (denominationalism), "I of Apollos", don't even say "I of Jesus" (congregationalism). In the Bible the church is a locality of believers in a region of church localities so you see the church of Jerusalem in the churches of Judea, the church of Antioch in the churches Syria, or the church of Dallas in the churches of Texas. If someone asks what church you belong to, speaking to Christians, say you belong to the church <your town> in the churches of <your state or province>. Even where 2 or 3 are gathered in His name. This treats the church as a locality responsible unto itself.

    As aberrant as the Roman Catholics and Protestants are in all their varieties they are still closer to traditional orthodox Christianity than Mormon will ever be because they are Monotheistic. Mormons are the most polytheistic and henotheistic religion on the planet. I know you want to think you are Christian, but you are so far away. You are very much like atheists, but call yourselves supernatural atheists. Mormons are not restoring anything, you're just a cult headed up by a con artist Joseph Smith. The Church has always been fine the past 20 centuries. It did not disappear. And think how evil that would be that people could not get saved for 18 centuries. You definitely do not believe in Jesus Christ because Jesus created all things and only the uncreated Creator can atone for sins; anything else is insufficient and deficient. Humble yourself to the One True God who's power and authority in being alone from everlasting with nothing beside Him, no gods, nothing. By the way Rev. 17.16 says a dirty nuclear bomb will blow up the Vatican the smallest city in the world.

    Therefore, Mormons must be wrong about thinking that the Church disappeared for 18 centuries. That would be crazy since people couldn't get saved for 18 centuries.
    The church did not disappear for 18 centuries. The priesthood authority to perform saving ordinances was lost, and some doctrines were corrupted, but there are many, many people who lived during that time who will receive salvation. I'm curious what your belief is regarding what a person must do to be saved. You seem to think that the Church is necessary for salvation, and I agree with you, but many evangelical Protestants believe that confessing Christ is all that is required. If it's important to have a church, how do you know which church it should be?
    There were no doctrines that were corrupted. That's what a cult would say. I can help you with each one you hold precious. The Bible remains intact. You are actually saying the Church disappeared because the body of Christ is a royal priesthood and for 18 centuries you claim it was without priesthood. If you are not a royal priesthood, you're not saved. All believers are a royal priesthood. You're trying to Judaize Christianity by having an intermediary other than Jesus. Saving ordinances do not exist, for anyone can come to Christ without your alleged ordinances. Baptism does not save; rather, baptism is symbolic of burial and resurrection with Christ and coming out of the world up out of the water with Jesus. It is performed with or without water and it is experiential and for service having a sense you no longer belong to this world like a sojourner. All you need to be saved is to accept Jesus so nobody is without excuse. The church is for fellowship and to draw people to Christ. The solution for you is to relinquish the idea you need big glorious buildings with the Pentagram on them calling down the power of Satan, without any crosses, and just accept walking to the mall, or at the gym, or perhaps a small gather with friends on your street that there the church. In the OT the groups broken up into counted as 50 individuals. This does not preclude 3000 or 5000 together at one time, but it is less optimal.

    You say that it would be crazy if people couldn't be saved for 18 centuries, and I would agree with you. But I have a question. What do you think about all of the people who lived for several thousand years before Jesus was born? What about all of the people who have lived who have never even heard of Jesus? Do they have any chance of being saved? The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is the only church I know of that claims that every single person will have a full and equal opportunity for salvation, regardless of when or where they lived. Most Christians believe that all of those people are going to hell, but I don't see a just and merciful God doing that. He wants us all to return to live with him forever.
    Firstly, those who were looking to their Messiah as their suffering servant whose hands would be pierced in Is. 53 are no doubt saved. But someone on a remote island who never heard of Jesus, yet rejected the idols worshiped as gods, and believed in the God of the mountains and stars surely if he was presented Christ would accept Him whole heartedly. As you see the Father you see the Son, and as you see the Son you see the Father for with the Holy Spirit they are the Trinity. Father is I AM and Alpha and Omega, and Jesus said the same about Himself. Test yourself. Ask yourself how would the word of God need to be worded to convince you in the Triune God? I find that the Bible expresses it so many ways in so many places it would be overly redundant to do more than what the Bible has already done to make the point. Hell is eternally rejecting the Triune God, because those who reject the Triune God can't be in heaven since there is no sin corrupting people with a lie and not humbling yourself to God with the truth. You want to think Christians believe people who receive common grace and have not heard the special grace of the gospel are going to Hell, but that's not what we believe. A merciful God is no a God who is going to send you to different heavens based on your works, nor is God merciful in sending you to Hell after you were saved. As Dave Hunt said, that would be a weird kind of salvation if you get saved, lose it, get it back and lose it again. God will just throw the whole of Mormons in Hell, and actually, you lock yourself in Hell from the inside because you admit you will never accept the Triune God. So be it.

    But the Bible says Hell can't come against the Church even though Mormons think it had.
    Let me ask you a question, Troy. As a Protestant, do you believe that the Catholic Church is the true church that Jesus established? If your answer is no, then that means that the original church must have become corrupted or changed, because the Catholic Church was the only church for many centuries. If your answer is yes, then why do you subscribe to Protestant beliefs that are different from the Catholic Church? My point is that both Mormons and Protestants believe that the original church fell into apostasy. Protestants believe that they can get back to the original truth by correctly interpreting the Bible, but which of the hundreds of Protestant interpretations is correct? Mormons believe that the only way to return to the authority and purity of the original church was for God to restore it through a prophet and through continuing revelation. I would invite you to seriously consider this possibility.

    Mike L.
    You're misreading the Bible. In Rev. 2 & 3 we see a review of the problems the Church will go through for the past 20 centuries. The first church which was in the first century is Ephesus. They lost their "first love". The 2nd century church was called Smyrna. God told them to hold on for 10 days more as they were heavily martyred. The 3rd century church was called Pergamum. Their mistake was marrying church and state under Constantine. These 3 churches passed, but the next 4 after starting remained even to today. The 4th church period was Thyatira with Jezebel. She represents the beginning days of the Roman Catholic Church. She was a mustard seed but then turned into a great big tree with branches birds landed on like demons. The next church period was called Sardis representing revivals, but like a glass a water refilled with less and less water each time. It became in the 15th century reemphasizing justification by faith. Of course Calvinist latch onto that and call themselves Reformed which is a misnomer since the church doesn't need reforming. It had all the tools it always had. Luther was not saved because he was a Calvinist like Augustine before him. The 6th church period was Philadelphia, brotherly love. They were in the 1830s called the Brethren Movement. This was a name given to them, but in actuality they just wanted to be called Christians; that alone distinguished them as Philadelphia. And the last church period we are in now at the tail end of today is Laodicea. They are considered neither hot nor cold, just lukewarm. For a deeper study of the 7 church periods from a Christian who had the highest IQ in Christendom,


    Protestants do not believe the Church fell into apostasy, for the church has always been there as a church locality in a region of churches. With so much corruption go on around the world and in Christendom, the little flock remained true. Apostles are directly commissioned by God to appoint Elders of each church locality, and in turn those Elders approve the Elders of the many meeting places in a locality. The church is a locality of believers responsible unto itself and does not need a big show and pomp like Mormons. Praise the Lord!

    None of the 150 sects of the cult of Mormonism are true, but those who are truly born-again Christians have no denomination. Your approach is all wrong. You are making the same mistake Joseph Smith made when he asked what is the correct church? Satan gave him the wrong answer. When you begin to see the church as a locality of believers and they as a unit are responsible to themselves, you won't need to be part of the Mormon cult. You will try to make your church locality run better the race (first get saved though). You'll stop looking to the outer and walk in the inner sanctuary of your spirit receiving intuitive revelation in your spirit by the Holy Spirit. There are Apostles, Prophets, Evangelists, Teachers/Shepherds every century as workers for the Church. But the prophet you follow is a false prophet. The New Jerusalem was never built in west Missouri within a generation and your Jesus never returned in 1891 as Joseph Smith promised. Besides Missouri is only about 264 x 264 miles. The New Jerusalem in Rev. 21 is 1379 x 1379 miles. Smith didn't understand this. For him it was always about west vs. east. The center from where Jesus will reign is the 3rd Temple in Jerusalem for 1000 years, not America. The sooner you accept this the sooner you can begin to make progress in your life towards who Jesus really is.
    by Published on 05-29-2014 06:25 PM     Number of Views: 430 
    1. Categories:
    2. Universalism

    How should you respond to someone who claims to accept the precious blood of Jesus for forgiveness of sins, that He died on the cross for the sins of the world to give us the free choice, to receive eternal life, and even accepts Jesus is God the Son, but they refuse to accept what Jesus said in John 3.16, because they are unwilling to accept close family members are unsaved and going to Hell who do not accept Jesus as Lord?

    "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life" (John 3.16).

    Jesus said only those who believe will not perish. So when someone says they are not convinced another person is going to Hell for rejecting Christ, they are denying what Jesus said in John 3.16. They worship a false Christ, certainly not God of the Bible. This is confirmed elsewhere.

    "He that is not with me is against me" (Matt. 12.30). So if you are not for the Jesus who sends people to Hell who deny Him then you yourself are going to Hell because you preach a universalist Jesus or pseudo-universalist Jesus. Pleading ignorance is not being for Jesus, but for the way the world acts.

    Similarly Matt. 10.32,33 reveals the same pretentious condition. If you are unwilling to confess who the Lord Jesus truly is, God in the likeness of flesh, who will send people to Hell for denying who He truly is, surely you will go to Hell.

    "Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven. But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven" (Matt. 10.32,33).

    A pseudo-universalist or pantheist who says it is not for him to decide is confusing what God decides (which He discloses in the Word of God) with the false Christian who claims to be a Christian when he says maybe a person is still saved who rejects Jesus. This makes a mockery of the cross of salvation. You should be agreeing with what God decides not pleading ignorance.

    You need to be firm with such people and allow God's righteous indignation to be expressed towards such neglect of the gospel of God's saving grace.

    There is another group of people that are not saved, those who preach the gospel only once every 10 years, if that, or who like to use the phrase "I pick my battles" to justify their being silent Christians. Since there is no such thing as a silent Christian, who can deny their silence and lack of love to share God's saving plan to others as a symptom of their own unbelief or lack of faith?

    by Published on 05-09-2013 12:32 AM     Number of Views: 838 
    1. Categories:
    2. Regeneration,
    3. Spiritual Christian Life,
    4. Universalism,
    5. Spiritual Warfare



    Have you come across people, and more potently family members, who claim to be Christians but are clearly not? They throw the word "Christian" around when tested as if somehow that automatically makes them a Christian. For example, a family member may think the atheist in the family or other members of the family are Christians even though they never want to discuss the gospel of salvation of Jesus Christ let alone hear about it. They get angry about it. So this "nominal Christian" (i.e. false Christian) essentially believes in universalism that they are all saved and is under strong delusion that they believe in Christ anyhow in some mysterious esoteric way. What a false Christ this would be!

    How does an atheist accept Christ when the atheist claims God does not exist? That is the most obvious case to put forward. But it is no less true to observe the contradiction in someone who may not vocally deny Christ, but certainly has not received Him for forgiveness of sins and resurrection life.

    This family member who is a false Christian may have accused you of being a fanatic for your faith as a Christian even though you were simply giving the gospel of salvation with love to another family member who is an atheist. You were saved so you ask this fake Christian family member when he or she was born-again? Never did he or she ever give you the gospel before you were saved (or even after). What love is that? But as the years go by this fake Christian says she or he was saved long before you were. What a surprise that is hearing it for the first time when just a few days ago she or he said she believed in reincarnation, universalism and never mentioned Jesus is God the Son. This is a perverted form of one-up-man-ship. This is how worldly people are. They don't care about the truth of the Scriptures or the Spirit of Truth.

    Not only have I experienced this demented game they play, but I know other Christians who have given me their testimony that they have undergone the same mind games from fake Christian family members. I would like to add as well, I have never met anyone over the age of 40 who ever gave their life to Christ so don't expect them to change. At some point you need to simply not discuss it with them anymore, kicking the dust under your feet even as Jesus and the Apostles did. Just be aware of this universalist deception. Obviously, the Scripture are clear that such antics and those who rely on such antics are headed straight for the Lake of Fire.

    What's even worse is they are responding to the Christian in such a way to tell the Christian what the Christian wants to hear that they believe in Christ, but what then of these false Christ? There are many false Christs. Presenting a false Christ is not Christ Jesus. They are really purporting to believe in a false Christ of universalism. That is to say, the atheist, deist, worldling and gnostic in the family are saved by this Calvinistic irresistibly imposed salvation from a false Christ. Apparently, nobody goes to Hell in this scheme except the really really bad people.

    I don't think this onslaught that Christians have to put up with is anything new, but when it touches close to your heart by those who are family members, you realize Satan is working overtime in the spirit of your family members.

    J
    esus said, "Everyone therefore who shall confess Me before men, I will also confess him before My Father who is in heaven. But whoever shall deny Me before men, I will also deny him before My Father who is in heaven" (Matt. 10.32,33).

    If you are unwilling to confess Jesus to others especially to close family members, obviously you are violating this verse, and therefore, you will go to Hell. Family members who reject Christ, that is, they don’t accept that He is God, died on the cross for the sins of the world, resurrected the 3rd day or make Him universalist shall spend eternity in Hell according to the Bible.

    I asked this particular fake Christian family member what would be his or her response when before the Throne when God asks, Do you accept Me and My decision to send the rest of your family members to Hell because they have rejected my only begotten Son? Her answer to me was, "Then I am going to Hell." I have never gotten her to ever admit she is going to Hell, but today she admitted it. Christians need to approach such people who worship a false Christ in precise ways to expose their own hearts back to them. What she is willing to do with this revelation is up to her. But you can see clearly she rejects the God who sends people to Hell whom are close family members. Call it a family-centric faith. If you love your mother, father, brother, sister or children more than me, you have not put Me first in your life to save you.

    As she has not shared the gospel of salvation with said family members, leaving an empty Church on her watch, by not giving the gospel of salvation to them when they are perishing shows she or he is not a Christian.

    “That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life” (John 3.15). Eternal life is not given to the person who is antichrist. If you are not for Him whom He truly is, you are in your heart of hearts truly against Him.

    “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life” (John 3.16).

    “He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God” (John 3.18).

    “And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil” (John 3.19).

    “For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved” (John 3.20).

    How should we confess Him? "...confess Me before men..." (Matt. 10.32).

    Jesus says in Mark 8.38, "For whoever is ashamed of Me and My words in this adulterous and sinful generation, of him the Son of Man also will be ashamed when he comes in the glory of His Father with the holy angels."

    Question: Is it wrong to be a Christian secretly in order to preserve your own life?

    Jesus Himself gives us the answer: "Therefore whoever confesses Me before men, him I will also confess before My Father who is in heaven. But whoever denies Me before men, him I will also deny before My Father who is in heaven. Do not think that I came to bring peace on earth. I did not come to bring peace but a sword” (Matt. 10.32-34).

    Christ made it clear to us that “if the world hates you, you know that it hated Me before it hated you. If you were of the world, the world would love its own. Yet because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you” (John 15.18-19). If you call yourself a Christian and don’t have this sense, it is because you are not a Christian.

    For a Christian, a secret faith is simply not an option.

    Another message that Jesus brought to the world: “They [the world] will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name's sake” (Matt. 24.9).

    “But watch out for yourselves, for they will deliver you up to councils, and you will be beaten in the synagogues. You will be brought before rulers and kings for My sake, for a testimony to them” (Mark 13.9).

    Christians have a mandate from Christ to “go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit” (Matt. 28.19).

    Paul echoes Christ’s directive with this query: “How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher? And how shall they preach unless they are sent? As it is written: ‘How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the gospel of peace, who bring glad tidings of good things!’” (Rom. 10.14-15)
    by Published on 01-03-2010 05:13 PM     Number of Views: 2991 
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    2. Universalism

    These Men Will Reap What They Sow

    Joel Olsteen took right out the play book of Billy Graham. If Billy Graham and Joel Olsteen are saved that's not a Heaven I want to go to. Thank you Jesus.

    Women can be Apostles, Elders and Teachers (that's one thing I disagree about with the speaker).

    Muhammad and the Pope are saved? Where does Billy Graham cite in his writings the verses of the Bible that say homosexuality and lesbianism are hellbound?



    Billy Graham said, "The Pope is the greatest religious leader of the modern world, and one of the greatest moral and spiritual leaders of the century."

    Billy Graham, Robert Schuller, and Joel Olsteen worship the universal Christ of the new age, not the exclusive Jesus of Christianity.

    Billy said of president Clinton, he "has not always won the approval of his FELLOW Christians but who has in his heart a desire to serve God and do His will" (Page 656, Just As I Am).

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